Suzanne Vizethann | Mental Health, Value of Pop-Ups, Empathy in Hiring - Ep. 163

Episode Notes

In this interview, chef Suzanne Vizethann delves into various topics related to the food industry. Aside from discussing the process of making soft scrambled eggs, she emphasizes the importance of prioritizing mental health in the hospitality industry. According to her, while it's easy to overlook mental health in the fast-paced and demanding environment of the food industry, it's crucial to address this issue to avoid burnout and turnover rates.

Additionally, Vizethann sheds light on the value of pop-up restaurants, which she believes are great for testing new concepts and reaching a wider audience. She also emphasizes the need for authenticity and empathy in hiring, stating that it's essential to look beyond just the resume and to consider the person's character and values.

Throughout the interview, Vizethann's core values of investment and authenticity are highlighted. She believes that investing in her team and creating a positive work culture is key to the success of her business. Interestingly, Vizethann mentions her recent change of mind on growing her business, indicating that she is still open to learning and exploring new ideas.

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Show Notes:

This episode is sponsored by 7shifts - get a 3-month trial of their "The Works" tier and unlock better team management for your team: https://www.7shifts.com/signup-influencer/?utm_source=influencer&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=justin-khanna-signup&utm_content=referral_3mfree&signup_coupon=REFERRAL_3MFREE

Buttermilk Kitchen Cookbook: https://geni.us/buttermilk-kitchen

Suzanne's Website: https://www.suzannevizethann.com/

The Buddha and the Badass Book: https://geni.us/buddha-badass

Traction Book: https://geni.us/traction-business

One Minute Manager Book: https://geni.us/new-1min-manager

Unreasonable Hospitality Book: https://geni.us/unreasonable-hosp

Andrew Huberman Podcast: https://hubermanlab.com/category/podcast-episodes/

Wylie Dufresne opens pizza place: https://www.grubstreet.com/2023/03/wylie-dufresne-opens-stretch-pizza-in-nyc.html

Eat the Frog productivity technique: https://asana.com/resources/eat-the-frog

Small Giants Book: https://geni.us/small-giants

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This episode’s transcript is auto-generated using software. Typos, misspellings, and errors might appear. If you have questions or fixes you’d like applied to this transcript, please reach out to hello@joinrepertoire.com.

Justin Khanna: today we have the pleasure of welcoming Suzanne Vizethann on the show.

She is a chef out of Atlanta. Her and I actually got connected. If you are familiar with previous podcast episodes we've done with a gentleman named. Dozfy he's an artist. He works in hospitality businesses doing murals, and he has a menu art project. They kind of, SFI used to live in Atlanta and so we kind of became internet friends, Suzanne and I.

And then during I close to the pandemic times, we started to chat a little bit more and she was getting into content creation and so her and I started to talk a little bit. And so that is just, you know, an interesting backstory on how her and I got connected and it's been long overdue to have her on the podcast because to, you know, gas up our guests a little bit.

I respect Suzanne a lot as both an operator. Her ability to just kind of like take advantage of an underserved market, which for her is breakfast. She's written cookbook, she's competed on tv. She's done a bunch of different stuff in the entrepreneurship realm and I'm just excited for her to share her knowledge.

And, you know, I, I gave a little bit of a preamble not to share too much because Suzanne will, will appreciate a little bit of the, the experimentation here. And just to be clear, I did proofread this before, I'm gonna say it, but I asked chat g p t four for a intro for Chef Suzanne. And so to kind of do a, do a funny, um, show you how this is powerful, this saved me probably like I don.

Three, four minutes of writing and a little bit of searching through her website. And also the way that it words it. I gave it the context of use language that would appeal to a restaurant operator. And please write a podcast introduction for Suzanne and to just give you a little bit more insight into how I'm using these tools.

I asked as a prompt, I asked, do you know who Chef Suzanne Zein is? And so it gave me confirmation that it did indeed know who she was.

And so here is chat GB T's intro to our guest today. All right, here we go. Today we have a special guest whose innovative approach to southern food, comfort, food, and commitment to local sustainable ingredients has captured the hearts and taste buds of food lovers in Atlanta and beyond. In this episode, we are thrilled to announce Chef Suzanne Zein, owner and executive chef of their renowned buttermilk kitchen with a keen eye for detail and a passion for creating dishes that leave a lasting impression.

Suzanne has transformed her restaurant in in Atlanta into a staple offering unique culinary experiences that celebrate the rich flavors of. Cuisine. Join us as we deep dive into the mind of this culinary maverick. Exploring her journey from humble beginnings to becoming an award-winning chef and restaurateur.

Get ready to learn from her expertise in menu creation, navigating the challenges of the food industry and building a successful brand that resonates with restaurant operators and food enthusiasts alike. So without further ado, let's give a warm welcome to the one and only Chef Suzanne. Not bad.

Listen as much as I know I say we're in the food business in a lot of ways we're in the people business And what that often requires is team management between trying to get the latest schedule out the door keeping track of all the time off requests your team puts in and finding out where your labor is tracking for the day It can be all so overwhelming Seven shifts is that secret weapon type tool That's your operations best asset Let seven shifts help you streamline your team's work schedule If you want to see the difference in your team's productivity and satisfaction Faction She's seven shifts is giving you listeners a three-month free trial of their the works tier which I'm actually super stoked on because it's unlimited employees on this trial So it's not like other trials where you kind of just get a little bit of the stuff You can do this with unlimited employees regardless of the size of your business So you can really kick the tires on the product and test all the great features like payroll integration and advanced reporting Visit join repertoire.com/seven shifts That's the number seven S H I F T S Or you can easily just click the link in the description of this podcast to try seven shifts now and see the difference for yourself Thanks so much to seven shifts for sponsoring this episode

Justin Khanna: Suzanne it's super, super good to see you and thanks for coming on the show. It's been long overdue that we can catch up and have this conversation.

Suzanne Vizethann: I know. Thank you for having me. I'm excited.

Justin Khanna: I did this breakdown of the show The Bear, and there's this episode in that show where they have this whole line, which is like, fuck brunch. And the story goes that you were working nights on the fine dining side of things and you're like, Hey, I'm actually a morning person. Breakfast is a meal that people love.

I'm gonna come in and capitalize on this underserved niche. So can you. Pose the argument for, for brunch, and maybe just talk a little bit about how you've kind of taken brunch and breakfast and made it this thing that you've kind of built your business off of in a really successful way.

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah. You know, again, I think obviously what it's very important, especially in a restaurant, any business is, you know, what, what makes you stand out, what makes you unique? So, especially for me in the Atlanta market, I knew there just wasn't many chef-driven restaurants out there. Br for brunch. I quickly found out why you know, at, for a chef brunch is brunch is very difficult and challenging.

Right? It's very fast paced. You're cooking eggs it's a grind for sure, and I definitely in the beginning missed the. Finesse of fine dining and, and just having time to start your day. You know, there's none of that in the breakfast restaurant. You were full steam ahead is the minute you walk in the door.

But I also knew that would give us a huge competitive advantage because no one was really putting, you know, it's like, why can't we take. A restaurant and make it breakfast, make it brunch, make it relatable, of course, but have those same details as you'd find in fine dining. So for us it was, it was a challenge.

I mean, people didn't understand why we were charging the prices we were charging. It took a lot of education, a lot of communication between our servers and our, and our guests. But once we got there, You know, it was, it just really set us apart from everybody else because most breakfasts and brunch places, unfortunately, are making things out of a box.

And and we, we, we just don't do things that way. We're, you know, we make everything fresh and that same pride, attention to detail and care you would find in a, you know, more of, of a fine dining type of situation. So that's been really important for us.

Justin Khanna: Can you expand a little bit on potential operational tips, things that you guys think that you have figured out where if you saw someone else executing brunch, even if they, like, let's say that the, the, the listener does want to do brunch well, like they do want to have a high level of execution.

Things that you teach your team or that your managers like to keep in mind with brunch that set you apart.

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, I think again, it, it's really the simplicity of using really great ingredients. It's, you know, I think, I always believe that a chef is as good as their ingredients they use. It doesn't have to be anything crazy. In the beginning I think I was, I overthought it almost in a way of, oh, everything has to be so perfect and, but I really do believe that if you just take pride and sourcing for us too, local is very important.

Sourcing local, but you know, it's, everything comes down from the buttermilk we use to the flour we use. And then that obviously has a huge impact on the execution, right? So it's little, little things like we heat our maple syrup, we keep it heated because I think that makes a, a difference.

Like I don't want cold maple syrup on my pancakes. We also use a hundred percent real maple syrup. And again, I think people just taste the difference. We like to fresh squeeze our juice. I just think a lot of those little details get missed in breakfast especially. So you know, again, we, we just try to tell our, we try to just educate our staff on why those little things make a big difference.

And so I would just encourage someone that does wanna have a breakfast or brunch restaurant to just pay attention to those little details they're easily overlooked, especially in breakfast where most people are striving to run an 18% to 22% food cost. We're running 30%.

So you just have to make sure that you're, you know, your menu prices reflect that. Right. Which, which can be a challenge. 

Justin Khanna: You, you touched on speed too, like there, there's a different level of, it's almost diner expectation and the way that people consume a meal like breakfast. And I talked about it in my breakdown video where it's like, there's often larger parties, whereas dinner you'll often see more. And it's not like brunch doesn't have like two ti, a large influx of two tops.

But I think that there's, there's a different 

 Diner expectation

Suzanne Vizethann: Yes. 

Justin Khanna: Can you talk a little bit about how you guys think about that or any sort of tips or operational strategies that you deploy there to make sure that meals

Suzanne Vizethann: Sure. So, you know, again, we do strive for 15 minute ticket times or less. And again, I, I just think that's what people expect in the, in the brunch diner environment. So, you know, in order to do that, we, we have a pretty big staff. I will say. Like we've got a lot of people on the line. We've got two expeditors, a food runner really just trying to ensure that the quality isn't missed to.

On that level and, and at that speed. But we also do a really good job of trying to communicate if a dish will take longer. Like for instance when we started out, we only served fresh print fresh prince, sorry, French press coffee in addition to, to drip coffee. But French press is, if, you know, takes, it's about a four to five minute process, right?

So we'll even write it right on the menu. You know, for this, because a lot of people, again, in, especially in the realm of breakfast, they have a very different expectation of what to expect from the food and, and the delivery. You know, they want coffee on the table immediately. So we really try to do our best to, to let them know if a dish is gonna take longer.

What those really outlining what those expectations are. And a lot of it is just, you know, your equipment, your setup. And breakfast foods do cook pretty quickly. Right. You know, I mean, our average pancake is taking only a couple minutes aside. You know, eggs are very, very fast. We were cooking completely on gas, you know, which I've, you have to have that when you're doing eggs and omelets and things of that nature.

But and we always put our most skilled person on the egg station and always have a chef or a manager. At the window, and we also, a big thing for us, we just implemented reservations, which is unheard of. I don't know. Do you have open table in Seattle?

Justin Khanna: Yeah, there, there's talk is pretty popular. Believe it or not, there's actually a couple places that do the Yelp wait list functionality. Which is fine. I mean, it depends, kind of depends on the place. But yeah, the, the one that, the ones that I'm most familiar with are, are resi and, and talk open tables.

Not as

Suzanne Vizethann: Resi is pretty big here too, but Open Table is probably bigger, but we've always resisted, our customers have always asked us for it, and we've always resisted it, but just because of, we thought we couldn't turn our tables fast enough. But I think it, what it's done for us is it's. Continued the education with our clientele of, Hey, here's what to expect.

Like this isn't a diner, this isn't, you know, you're gonna get more of a curated experience here. And it just, I think it sets the expectations. And so when they do sit down, they realize, okay, like this is gonna be more of an elevated brunch type experience. If I may, if I wait 15 to 18 minutes for my, for my food, it's gonna be okay.

And we, and, and the, again, the servers will sell an appetizer. They'll, they'll sell a cocktail. You know, things like that, that always help with, with that wait time.

Justin Khanna: I am a huge proponent of that because I find that most people see it. Poor service to tell someone that there is going to be additional time that's required, it's going to be more expensive. Hey, there isn't that much actual availability on this item. And it's seen for whatever reason, as like poor service or hospitality to communicate these seemingly negative things, and I feel like people paint them with an apology.

When in reality it's just being clear with the guest and most people appreciate it compared to, I'm sure you've experienced this, like you go to a place that is just not willing to have that transparency and then you're just frustrated as, as a guest

Suzanne Vizethann: Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. It's all about communication, right? I mean, it's just as clear as you can be. Even, I mean, let's face it, most restaurants you walk into now are gonna be understaffed and we, we do little things such as putting signage up at the door that says, It's just a reminder. Please be kind please be kind.

We're still understaffed, but I think it starts at the door, right? So you just, you simply greet someone when they walk in. You let them know, Hey guys, it's gonna be a couple minutes. You know, if the server can't get to the table right away, a manager walks over, Hey, your server will be right with you. Can I start you off with a drink?

You know, just little things like that. I think that's just as who we are as human beings. We just wanna be communicated to and always know what's going on.

Justin Khanna: You brought up the word coffee. The word on the street is you have a new machine in the restaurant. Can you talk to me about espresso and how you've been nerding out about that?

Suzanne Vizethann: So personally, I'm a big espresso fan. I start every morning with an Americano light on the water. And I'm just a, a kind of a c coffee. Geek, I guess. And we've always, we've never had an espresso machine. I think partly because we didn't really have the space, we didn't have the staff. You know, I could list a million reasons, but maybe it was fear.

But we finally got our our espresso machine in. We hired a barista, and it's just been amazing. There's been a latte or a cappuccino almost on every table, and. It's just a, it's an amazing, curated experience and I think that it really delivers on that amazing brunch experience that people really want, so.

Justin Khanna: I mean, it goes in with the ethos of, hey, this is gonna take a little bit of extra time. But it allows, I think you and I were talking before, like it allows you to charge more. Your check average has gone up. It it, it is in more line with You know, it's not like drip coffee is coffee out of a out a bag in the same way that brunch items, you know, could be out of a bag.

But I think that there is an element of like, it, it's so in line with everything else that you guys are doing, 

Suzanne Vizethann: here's a coffee that's brewed and curated just for you, especially for you. It's really exciting. And again, yeah, just like you stated, like it, it's completely in line with what we are we're doing and what we're offering.

Justin Khanna: I want to talk to you about your strategies and transparencies as an operator in kind of doing a little bit of research on you for, for this conversation. I stumbled upon an Instagram post you made where you were literally talking about the fact that like very transparently, I'm not being clear enough with my team and I.

I love that. I, I I, I wish that I could have seen more content like that when I was coming up and becoming a first time manager in a restaurant. And so I guess, have you always been like that? Like, did, did you feel like you had to push back on, on the stereotypical chef culture? Like t talk to me about that cuz in the greater scheme of restaurant owners, I would call that weird.

Like you and I being, you know, trying to be kind, empathetic leaders is not normal. So, so talk to me about where that came from and, and how you've

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, I think, you know, originally starting out and I, I feel like a mistake that most chef, restaurant owners, let's, let's start with, let's start with the chefs, right? Cuz that's, That's how I am. That's who I, who I was. That's how I got started in the restaurant industry. I think a lot of reason that those types of people fail when they open restaurants is because they don't clearly understand the business side.

It takes so much more than, oh, I can cook. And I think, luckily for me, when I first opened it was I was in the business, not on the business. I, you know, as most of us fall victim, I never understood about communicating. I didn't even barely know my front of the house. I just ran around like a chicken with my head cut off half the time.

But as I, what I started to really, really appreciate was the business side of it, and that you have this whole team of people that are looking to you, and if they don't know your vision and your strategy, they're not gonna all be on the same page. And so we did. It's, you know, oddly enough, or funny enough, we did this exercise where we asked our management team who is responsible.

We, we listed out like, I don't know, seven or eight scenarios of. What's something, what, which specific manager was responsible for that task and out of all the answer, all the questions we asked, I mean they hardly any of them got all the same answer. Correct. So it just kind of goes to show you, it's like that telephone game you played when you were a kid is like, How easily something can get misconstrued.

And you think that somebody's on the exact same page as you are, but in reality, we all learn differently. And I, I've come to realize that nobody can read my mind. So it's so important to articulate your vision and your strategy and where you want your business to go and what your mis mission statement is.

And so that's something we're really working on is like how do we unify .

Justin Khanna: If someone is listening to this and they're saying, Shoot, Suzanne's, right? Like, I don't, I don't have that figured out either. Do you have any sort of like practical frameworks that you guys have put out there and, and created for your team, whether it's like an org chart or some sort of visual graphic that you've created, or maybe it's just better job descriptions.

Talk, talk to me about how the person listening can potentially take a step back in their business and, and look at all their responsibilities and be. Okay. This is how I'm going to actually concretize this 

Suzanne Vizethann: Sure. I, a really big thing for us is an accountability chart. It sounds very elementary, but

Justin Khanna: Or corporatey, you know what I mean? Like it sounds like we, we like to think of restaurants as these like, oh, it's, it's the art. It's, or like, oh, it's the craft. We're not, we're not a big business, but in reality it's like, you're right. Most people fall victim to these basic problems because they push back on

Suzanne Vizethann: And I think it's that like creative side to being a chef, right? And because it's really like cooking is your hobby. And when you think about it, it's like if your business isn't making money, it's your hobby. And so I think that we do, we need to professionalize the industry as a whole and really look at it as this is a business.

You know, at the end of the day, like it's just food and it's gotta, if you're not making money, then it really is just your hobby. So I picked up the book called Traction, which I really highly recommend.

Justin Khanna: I love that book. I love that

Suzanne Vizethann: And we actually started working with a local integrator. So in most cities they have an integrator that will actually walk you through how to do the exercises.

I put my whole management team through it. And one of the big key takeaways from it is having that accountability chart and really clearly defining your roles, right? Like who's responsible for what, because if two people are responsible for one thing, it's not gonna get done. So that's really helped us tremendously and we display it for all the staff to see again, do they, do some of them, really understand?

Maybe not. But I, I, it has been a game changer for us of, if we have a question about something, we look at the chart and we revisit. We make sure to revisit quarterly cuz it does change. And just really putting effort. Into those things. Yeah. That's helped us a lot.

Justin Khanna: You touched on this point before we started recording on this idea of having to repeat yourself with the things that you value, the vision that you've set. Can you kind of bang that drum a little bit more for folks if they're, you know, having, experiencing high turnover or they're like, well, I told my staff this once already.

I feel victim to this too, where it's. You need to set the tone consistently, consistently, consistently, almost to the point when your staff, I, I, I look at it now as like, oh, some of the best cultures and restaurants that I can remember, where I really look to them as like a beacon for standards or operational excellence.

It's almost like you can make fun of them. Like, you can meme, you can meme it, you, and people would call it drinking the Kool-Aid or whatever, but I look at that now. Yes, exactly. And I look at that now and I'm like, oh, well they actually were doing a really good job of articulating that. So can can you jam

Suzanne Vizethann: yeah. Absolutely. And, and by the way, I'm a huge believer in that myself. And I know it can be kind of cult-like and drinking a Kool-Aid, but at the same time it's, you know, it's so important to, I think, Us as humans, we need to hear things at least five times, which can seem very frustrating to an owner or a manager to tell your employee over and over and over again.

But it, it takes at least five times for something to click. So one thing that we actually did for the first time to start the quarter, and we're now gonna do it every single quarter as we call it, the state of the company meeting, and that's where the owner gets up. So I get up and my management team gets, And we briefly go over again what the vision is.

We talk about the finances. Again, we don't share all the numbers, but we do share like a five line p and l. So just the very basic, you know, here's the revenue, here's the labor, here's our profit. And also it's really important to like remember to celebrate the wins, right? So with the staff, it's so easy to harp on the negatives, which I used to do a lot in the beginning of my career.

But now I really try to celebrate those little things especially with the staff, because that, that makes them feel really important. But yeah, just, just going over and over again, what are our goals? What are we striving for? What's our marketing efforts? Who's our actual, who is our, our target audience?

Right? That's important too. And really understanding who that customer is. So that's, that's been, that's been huge for us. It's just over and over again. Every time we have a lineup, every time we have a company meeting, we talk about, okay, what is our company vision? And we also like to address every problem or question with what is gonna be best for the business.

It's not personal. But what is going to be best for this restaurant

Justin Khanna: I have this funny thing that I've been telling my team lately, which is kind of how I'm wanting to take repertoire as a brand, being a, an educational force for the industry, and it's this kind of, I, I, I struggle to say anti true cooks, but there is some ethos of that. I don't know if you're familiar with the brand True Cooks, but it's this like pirate culture, tattooed sleeves.

Just figure it out. You know what I mean? Kind of. Kind of. And I never really resonated. And, and I think that it's so interesting that you are pioneering something different. I'm trying to put something, that's why I think I, I, I wanted to jam with you so much on this stuff. I guess my question for you is, if you have someone that.

Comes in with that kind of mentality. Do you find that they're having a little bit of whiplash? Are there things that, that, that person has to unlearn because you're like, we actually do things a little bit more buttoned up here, and, and, and does that person eventually come around to appreciating that?

I guess I'm trying to, I'm trying to understand. Cuz it's so popular in our industry to be a pirate, you know? And, and I, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't know. That was never for me. And so I guess, how, how do

Suzanne Vizethann: I think it's we're artists, right? And you get this mentality, and I struggled from this a little bit in the beginning, is like, you just want to create this. You live in almost a delusion, a little bit of like, oh, I just wanna create 10 dishes and serve it to the, the foodies and the chefs. But like in reality, we are not serving other chefs.

We're serving the general public, and chefs need to understand that. And I think what has done our industry a big disservice is like this rockstar persona that's been created through the food network and the open kitchen vibe and the tattoos and you know, we're this like rockstar. In reality, it's probably like 10% of the population that can survive that way.

Right. Again, it. If that's how you really want to cook and that's how you really wanna make a living, you should just cook as your hobby and you should do private dinner parties in your home because it's just not, it's just not realistic. And again, I do, I do believe people really do want like a cool experience.

But for me, what I do is to really flex that muscle. I'll do a pop-up dinner or I'll do a cool something know, a seasonal jam that I can, can, or I'll pickle something or I'll do something that like, lets me flex that creative muscle. But we have had a really hard time hiring chefs in the past just because for that reason.

They're just, it's like they're too creative. They're always wanting to put 16 garnishes on something or, you know, it is just like, I respect that, I have a love for that, but in reality it's just, It's almost like you can equate it to becoming a famous rockstar. Right? How hard is that to do? 

Justin Khanna: And how long

Suzanne Vizethann: long is it exactly?

Like there's a very small, I mean, look at Wylie Dufresne. He's opening a pizza place. He opened a donut concept, you know, I mean, And no, I think it's smart of him. He's a smart businessman. You know, he realizes that restaurants like, you know, WD 50 and those really high end fine dining experiences, it's just, it's really hard to, to make that a sustainable living.

Justin Khanna: Do you have any other helpful frameworks? You talked about the traction book. I know that you and I geek out about a lot of the same business creators, and you listen to podcasts too. I, I guess, can you talk a little bit about other resources that you've found helpful? Because, We have all, we have, we have cookbooks galore.

Like we have all of these, you know, creative in inspirational food styled, you know, recipes. But I, I shared it on a podcast a couple weeks ago where I got a lot of inspiration from like, entrepreneurship books as I kind of like stepped into this next chapter of not being a sous chef anymore. So, so what else has been

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah. And, and honestly, I I love that you bring that up cuz I used to be just such an avid cookbook reader and I mean, of course I still have my cookbooks. I love them. But I read more business books now and entrepreneur books and again, I'm, I'm very fortunate that I have a love for those things cuz it's so vital and to running a business.

One Minute Manager is, is a great book that's, we give that to all of our new manager. Very easy read, easy to comprehend. The Buddha and the Badass has been, I don't know if you've read that. Amazing. It's like, it's like my Bible. I like to read about 10 minutes of it every morning if I can. It goes through a lot of just you know, kind of how to visualize your ideal life and how to find this work life balance.

When you're a business owner, I highly recommend that book. Another one we just are recently reading is , unreasonable Hospitality, Will Guidara from 11 Madison Park. And it's really fun. My general manager and I actually do a book club on it, so we read four to five chapters. We come together, we talk about it.

That's been, that's been really fun and amazing. I'm trying to think. Oh, there's so many good one.

Justin Khanna: What about like shows that you listen to or content creators who have put out frameworks that you've adopted?

Suzanne Vizethann: So show, you know, I don't listen to as many podcasts. I listen to Andrew Huberman sometimes.

Justin Khanna: Yep,

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, he's, he's awesome. Again, I'm really into kind of that balance and health and taking care of myself. I've always been really, really passionate about the health industry. 

Justin Khanna: Let's pivot there for a second, I guess, because I wanted to jam with you on that. Not a lot of chefs prioritize their health. I, it took me I was set six or seven years into the industry. I had just become a manager. I was at a point where I wasn't kind of like straining myself on the line physically every single day.

And so I decided, okay, well I'm actually going. Come home at, it was around midnight and I'm gonna sleep until seven 30. I'm gonna wake up, I'm gonna have coffee, and then I'm gonna be at the gym at eight 30 and then I'm gonna be at the gym from eight 30 to nine 30. I'm gonna come home, shower, and then I can be back in the restaurant by 11, you know, to like start my shift again.

And that was the only time when I was actually able to, to, to start it's gone nowhere but up from here for me, which I've, I've really enjoyed and, and I, I totally u understand the fact that I'm not in a restaurant day-to-day anymore. So I have a little bit more of that time to focus on that.

But how, how have you, one, let's, let's start there. How, how has health come to light for you? Has that always been a priority? And, and what are some habits that you've leveraged lately?

Suzanne Vizethann: you know, I, I wanna say, I wanna say it's always been a passion. I don't think it's always been a priority, just because, you know, like you, it's, you're on the line, you eat standing up, you, you know, it's, I have, I always have had a lot of anxiety. It's very hard for me to pay attention in situations.

It's hard for me to sit at a computer, like, I think chefs too in general are very just on the go. Lots of energy. And, and yeah, it's hard when you're working like a 12 hour shift to, to prioritize anything. But I think what kind of clicked for me is when I lost my dad he, you know, he was older and it was, it was, he had a heart condition.

But you start to realize, I remember like l like his last years in life, he just, he wasn't exercising. He really wasn't prioritizing his health in any way. And it was like, God, I feel like he would've prolonged his life if he had done those things. And that's like really when things started to click for me.

And then obviously I think like everybody else, COVID you start to realize, oh my gosh, like you have this amazing body, that can repair itself. And I mean, the things that the, the human body can do is, is amazing. Right? And so we gotta take care of it. And so I think that it's, if you don't take, if you don't put a priority in that, you know you're not gonna be around very long.

Justin Khanna: Totally. And no one else is gonna do it for

Suzanne Vizethann: right. And I, and I understand it's, it is really hard, but for me, I think I'm, luckily I am a morning person anyway, but just establishing a morning routine that you can stick to.

Justin Khanna: Can you run us through yours,

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, absolutely. So I love to, so I have a dog, which helps a lot. An active dog. So what I try to do the first thing in the morning, as soon as I wake up, I take him on a walk.

I just try to get outside for, you know, 15 minutes if I can. And usually that'll turn into maybe 20 minutes, . Then I usually have, I usually take a shower and then I'll end with a cold shower. I love the cold exposure. It just kind of wakes me up, gives me a ton of energy. And then I usually will have my coffee and that's when I, I love to like, I call it eat the frog, which I sit down and I tackle. Whatever the, the worst task is of the day. You know, it's either, it's usually something administrative. It's like checking the email or writing a recipe or doing something that I just don't love doing. I knock that out first. Then I usually will take a break cause my mind just needs a break. I'll meditate.

I might do a little yoga. I, I'm really into naps now, which I've never been a nap taker ever. I'm not a great sleeper, but, Even if I can lie down for about 30 minutes, somewhere in the middle of my day, it helps tremendously for me. And yeah, I just, I, I try to eat a breakfast, like a good, well-rounded breakfast, usually like eggs, maybe some fruit, a whole grain.

And that just helps me a lot, you know, just really trying to take, if I do get overwhelmed or I start to get tired, even just taking a five minute break to breathe is, is huge. And I really try to teach that to my management team too do some yoga, just find a way to, to, to get present and block out all that, that noise.

Justin Khanna: Do you find that that also like do, do people push back on that? I, I just, I, I think it's funny to sometimes see people who neglect their health. On one hand, and then they will also say, look how dedicated I am to this craft and this work and this job, or whatever. Not realizing that if they were to prioritize the health side a little bit more, it would allow them to be more engaged, to be a better teammate.

Continue playing the game for longer. And I just think that's a funny thing where people will push back on the health stuff because like, oh, well, whatever, whatever. Insert reason.

Suzanne Vizethann: Well, and I think it, what's it's like, it's all through experiences, right? Like what we just need to like globally do a better job of is we have to start teaching it in school. You know, I mean, it's. And I, and I think they are doing that now. Like they're, they are starting to teach meditation. And so I think as you get older and you go through the experiences of, well, God, that really didn't work very well for me, I think that's harder to, to translate that to a, you know, 22 year old who's never been taught any of those things.

And so unfortunately it might take something for like, oh, they burned out, or they had a bad experience for them to really like start to prioritize it. But also more importantly, as an industry, We need to priorit prioritize that. Like it's unheard of to give a server a cook, a break for lunch or 10 minute, you know, step off the line, collect your thoughts.

So we're, as a company trying to, to implement things like that, like giving somebody a break, letting them go take lunch you know, it, it's just difficult in the hospitality industry to do that. So I think collectively, like as owners, like we in leaders, we need. To learn how to prioritize that, and I think staff and employees will follow suit.

Justin Khanna: Can you talk a little bit about, with the success of, of your projects and understanding that you do popups too, how do you, do you have any frameworks that are helpful for how to say no? Because I think that, you know, between TV things and making content and writing another cookbook, there's, there's just so many things that people can be pulled in directions of.

So how do you, how do you say no or how do you, how do you think about

Suzanne Vizethann: an amazing topic and I will say as a woman it's can be very difficult to say no. But you know, it, it's really like exercising a muscle, right? You just have to practice it. Just saying no is not a bad thing. I've learned that the hard way. I used to just do everything. But now through experience, I've learned to, I like to really think about something before I commit to it, and it's like, okay, is this, is this the best decision for the company?

Is this the best decision for me? And one thing that I started to do now that I've never really did, Is just getting advice from people. If I have a question of whether or not I should do something, I'm very fortunate to have, be surrounded by an amazing team of people and I go to them now for support.

You know, what do y'all think? Should I do this? Is this best for us? You know, it's really as simple as that, where before I really try to build up these walls and do everything on my own, and I'm very hardheaded and stubborn and just trying to work through that with the help of, of my peers really. But yeah, say no, say no is tough.

And I, I will tell you, I've, I did learn that the hard way of, of taking on too much and then realizing, okay, that was not, that wasn't a great decision, but.

Justin Khanna: There are a lot of folks listening who see the value in popups, or that's literally their strategy for how they're gonna launch their concepts, and so, We talked a little bit about how you think about operations in, in the restaurant. Do those principles change when you think about a popup?

Are there any sort of strategies or tactics that you guys think about when you're doing a popup that might be beneficial for the audience to think about of like, Hey guys, we figured this out and we don't do this and we set things up this way, that, that might help

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, I think maybe cuz we've done some popups before that have been really successful. But I would say like in the past I've kind of done them a little bit more blindly where it's like, Again, that's where the chef, the creative side kicks in. I'm like, Ooh, this sounds fun. Without really a plan or a vision.

So I, I will say like, if you are planning to do a pop-up, it needs to be more premeditated, right? So it it's a great way to, to do r and d on something. So if you have a concept in mind that, let's say for instance, you wanna do hamburgers, okay, who's my target audience? Where would I potentially open, like have a framework, have a plan, and then use that pop up as I'm gonna test the market.

I'm gonna see what they really want. I think a lot of chefs just go into it where they're just, at least I did. It was more just for fun and I didn't really have a plan. And you know, because of that, I don't think I was as successful as, as it could have. But popups are great. Like, I think that's great.

Return on, on your investment. Profit margins are really high, so you know, just, yeah, I think if it's a great, easy way to, to test an idea,

Justin Khanna: , how do you think. Growth is maybe what I'll call it, that this, this like, well, we could expand to other cities we could take on more versus this idea of no, we're actually gonna just dial in what we have. There's there, there's this great book. I think it's small giants. It's, it's, you know, companies who choose to be, I think the subtitle is Companies Who Choose to Be Great Instead of Big.

Do Do, do you follow that philosophy a little bit? How do you think about, about growth? Because I think people, people see a little bit of success and they feel compelled to just continue to feed the machine versus, you know, just dialing in what they have and being, I don't know.

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, I mean, I'm definitely more of a component of, you know, do less better. And it, there's been a reason, I mean, we've, our restaurant's been open 10 years and we've, I've turned down every opportunity to open a second location. Now, I, I can't tell you that I would never do it. Would I open 10? No. I just feel that our model specifically is not really gear.

It's just you lose your uniqueness. I used to tell people all the time, like, they're like, why don't you have a second one? I was like, well, there's only one of me. So, you know, I think there's a lot of importance and you, you really wanna crawl before you walk, I guess. So if you have an amazing team, an infrastructure in.

By all means, go ahead, replicate it. I think that's totally doable. But I think where some people fall too victim is they, they grow too fast and they don't have those procedures in place. And again, there's a reason, you know, you can knock corporate all you want. But I do think there's that, that balance where you can find kind of like restaurant style with corporate style.

But it's really, really important that you have all those procedures in place first. And I think people, 

 they just, they grow too fast and they just get this opportunity to open somewhere and they haven't really figured it out yet, and so they just stretch themselves too thin.

Justin Khanna: I to your artist point, I think what I, the, maybe the way to equate it is people set up two stages for them to, they're, that they themselves to perform at. When they open a second location, it's like, well, I have this stage that I perform at, and then I'm just gonna open another stage for me to perform at not understanding that you actually need to think about it more like two concepts that can run.

Suzanne Vizethann: Right.

Justin Khanna: Is that maybe a,

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah. No.

Justin Khanna: This is the first time I'm

Suzanne Vizethann: I think that's complete. You're completely right. And it's like, kind of like, well, I can't be in two places at once. But I do think that if you plan it correctly and you have the right people in place and you know you have the right brand and all that, it's, it's 100% can be done. I guess.

We just haven't, we're not there yet. We wanna grow in ways like, such as catering and. Private events and maybe a bakery and kind of everything going back into the restaurant, maybe a farm one day. We have this kind of vision of, of, we call it Buttermilk Village. 

Justin Khanna: Yeah.

Suzanne Vizethann: but you know, again, I think that it can totally be done.

I mean, look at Chick-fil-A, look at places like that. Like you can, it can be done, the quality can be there, but you do have to introduce sort of that corporate style to be success.

Justin Khanna: I don't wanna spend too much time on this topic, but I get a lot of questions from folks who get that DM from the casting agent on TV things, and, and you've been on some programs before, and so I guess to the person who has just gotten reached out to of, Hey, I want you to be on. A Guy Fieri show, or I want you to be on Chopped or Top Chef just reached out. Do you have any tips there on how people can make the most of a TV experience?

Suzanne Vizethann: number one, first and foremost, it kind of goes back to like saying no, right? Make sure it's a good fit for you personally. I, I, I actually just got a DM the other day. They wanted me to be on , some baking competition. And can I, can I do fundamentals of baking? Yes. Am I a pastry chef? No.

So, probably wouldn't be the best fit for me. So I would say first and foremost, just make sure like it's the way that you wanna be represented. And then if you do decide to do it, you know, just do your research, do your homework, watch the show, obviously, depending on what type of show it is. And just be true to yourself.

I will say that what people probably don't understand if they've, obviously they've never been on TV is. Is they wanna make good tv, right? So with that comes drama and producers and they are there to capture something interesting and you don't wanna get too caught up in that. You know, just, just be authentic and genuine and cook your food no one else's.

And try to just as hard as it is, just try to drown out that noise. And be you like, authenticity is the most important thing when you're doing anything like that, and it totally resonates when you're there. 

Justin Khanna: Do you find that it. Either in the moment gives you a little bit of credence for your business, like you see a spike in people who are coming to, to the restaurant or visiting your Instagram profile or, or whatever, or do you see it much more as there's actually more benefit I can get long-term from this association with Bobby Flay or the Food Network or Bravo.

Because I can now forever say I was on X, Y, Z 

Suzanne Vizethann: ​ I think it really depends. For Chopped is, was such an amazing growth exercise for me personally as a chef., like, if you are on one of those types of shows, do not expect your Instagram following to devil overnight. It will, it will not. But it will really help you grow as, as a chef.

Now, when we did Diners, drive-Ins and Dives with Guy Fi. sales doubled that that show is. So, I mean, it's like 44 million viewers on the first night or something, and then they just keep repeating it. And so that, those types of situations really healthy for the business. Great exposure. I mean, you couldn't pay for that type of advertising.

I mean, you could, but it would be a fortune. So it really just depends again, like on picking what is best for you in that moment.

Justin Khanna: There's a, I have one more question for you and then I want to get into some rapid fire ones. When we're talking about, and I don't know how much of the, the hiring that you do, but maybe you can talk about the times that you were kind of sitting in the hiring chair. I call this the, the meta job interview question.

So you ask someone a question as part of an interview. What I find when I'm interviewing folks from my team is like, it's not what I'm looking for in their, in the answer. It's like, how do they answer it? Is there an under, it's like there's, there's something deeper to their answer. Is there anything that you like to keep in mind in interviews or maybe a specific question that you ask and what you're looking for to help screen candidates that might be a part of your 

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, I try, you know, We try to stick to. Well, I'm, I try to completely remove myself from HR now . But . We have core values that, so we, that's really something that we like to look for.

And one of them, the, the most important one to us is investment, is that employee gonna be invested. So, I kind of like to go like off the script a little bit. I like to understand who that person is outside of work. Do they have hobbies? Do they have goals? You know, are they driven? And also like most importantly, I like to ask them what they already know about the restaurant.

Like, have they done their research? Because we're different than most restaurants and the fact that we stress heavily on sourcing local, supporting the community it's not just food to us. It's different. It's about that whole connection. So I also, I always like to learn, like to see if they are enthusiastic about that, because then I know that they'll be invested in what we're doing. 

Justin Khanna: I love that. Let's do some rapid fire ones. Cause I wanna

Suzanne Vizethann: okay. Oh gosh. I'm not good at rapid fire.

Justin Khanna: it's okay. It's okay. We'll, we'll you, I, I say they're rapid fire questions. They don't have to be

Suzanne Vizethann: Okay. I feel good.

Justin Khanna: If that, if that's helpful, if that's helpful. So, so, this show's called the Repertoire Podcast.

I define repertoire as this kind of set of skills that you take with you. And so a way to potentially tee this up might be if Suzanne had to, you know, get reset to zero and there was all these skills that you had previously on a shelf and you had to pick one out to potentially start with what's like the most valuable part of your repertoire, the thing that you would pick first to kind of take with you if you had to start over again.

Suzanne Vizethann: Oh my gosh. Ooh. I guess maybe like learning how to read people.  There's so many different personalities and learning how to, you know, can someone, can you be more firm with someone? Do you have to be more gentle? So, yeah, I guess that's something that's helped me tremendously.

Justin Khanna: Do you define that? Would you define that as empathy or would you define that as more like contextual adaptability, maybe?

Suzanne Vizethann: Probably a little bit of both. You know, I think you, you definitely have to be empathetic to all types of people cuz you have no idea what's going on. You know, their spouse could have asked for a divorce a week ago there, you know, there's so many different things. So I think that's so, so important.

But I guess just learning again, like as a chef, I, I, when I started I just thought I had to cook. But it's learning how to, to, to exi to coexist with all different types of people. Behaviors and personalities. So I'm, I'm way more open and receptive to that now than I've ever been

Justin Khanna: You're probably the most positioned per person on this podcast to answer this question, I ask guests, it's a Saturday morning and you go into your kitchen. It's the first day of your weekend and you're gonna make eggs for yourself. How do you make those

Suzanne Vizethann: soft scrambled. So this is what I'm doing right now. Soft scrambled in a taco. I like to toast off my tortilla, like over a flame taco. Make like a little like spicy aioli, maybe some pickled vegetables, crispy bacon, some cheese. The soft scrambled I love and I love poached eggs, but probably soft grill.

Justin Khanna: What's one thing you've changed your mind on in recent memory, if anything comes to.

Suzanne Vizethann: Ooh probably growing the business honestly. I used to be really against more of that corporate style, and I'm, I'm way more for it now.

Justin Khanna: Was it just a slow nudge of, of seeing other people operating their businesses, or was there just kind of like a, a singular moment i, I always like to ask this because it's some, sometimes it's like that, it just chips away at you over and over again, or sometimes, depending on how the person learns, it has to be this experience of like the quote unquote hitting rock bottom for you to realize, oh shit, something needs to change

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah, I think it's more just like through business books. Like there wasn't like a, I don't, I don't think there was just like one moment that changed, but I think it was more just like I never really understood how to run a business and once I started to really educate myself on that, I really started to change my mind on certain things of like, okay, not everything has to be so perfect.

Like we can still serve a good, consistent product, but also turn a profit at the same time and like, that's okay. So yeah, I think that was a really big, big lesson for me.

Justin Khanna: You somehow get a call right after this interview that you just want an all expenses paid trip to eat at your dream restaurant, and when you get there, there's someone you've always wanted to speak with, waiting to have dinner with you. 

Suzanne Vizethann:  That's a good one. Gosh, I, well, I've never been to a Linea. I would love, I would love to go there. And I would probably bring. Ooh, this is gonna be funny. This is like totally off. Not in the same industry. I would, I, I would wanna sit with Jimmy Fallon just because I love him and he would make me laugh and I don't know.

Justin Khanna: It's the perfect kind of environment to Aline, so like playful with their food that he would just probably be like

Suzanne Vizethann: Yeah. I mean, I think he's awesome and I feel like he loves food and we would just have a good time. So,

Justin Khanna: Is there anything you'd ask him? Like if you genuinely got to sit with Jimmy Fallon for three

Suzanne Vizethann: Gosh I don't know, maybe like more of just like how he, how he kind of made this transition of, of making him turning himself into a, a brand. You know, I think a, a good thing too is like, what I've also learned is how to invest in yourself and your name is your brand. And I never thought about that before and I think he's done a really good job, obviously.

Of turning himself into a brand. But I also like how his style is. He, he's never too serious and he kind of always keeps it lighthearted. And I would maybe just ask him like, how do you, how do you find that balance? How do you find that happiness of being super, super famous, but also like, I don't know, he just seems to really, genuinely have fun at the same time.

And so I'd probably ask him how he, how he does.

Justin Khanna: Suzanne, I respect you a lot and what you do and how you're navigating the world and business and your own personal life. And so I just wanna say thank you for coming on. Is there anything that we didn't get a chance to talk about or anything that you wanna leave the, the 

Suzanne Vizethann: audience with.

Um, I, I feel like we covered a lot of it. I will say I'm just, I just learned I'm gonna be writing a second cookbook, so look out for that. I'm very excited. But no, yeah, I think we we covered most of it and I really appreciate you having me on.

Justin Khanna: Where do you want to send folks ideally to, let's say, maybe get in touch with you first 

Suzanne Vizethann: a, a great way to get in touch is either through my Instagram, it's at chefie suzanne. Or you can find the restaurant at Buttermilk Kitchen. My email is suzanne buttermilk kitchen.com and you can find us on Open Table if you wanna come eat with us or through our website is www dot Buttermilk Kitchen dotcom

Justin Khanna: suzanne, thanks again. It's always great to see you and catch up. Thanks.